Pro Soccer

[hushhush]

Yeah, but that's because it is a big fat circle!
That's the problem. Players like Kasey Keller, Taylor Twellman, and Landon Donovan are precisely the type of product we get in U.S. soccer because the ones who play it and stick with it are usually upper-middle class white boys from the suburbs.

I dunno. I coached the boys team at school a few years ago. (A woman coaching the boys squad went over really well with some of the more macho dads...) About half of the boys were Landon Donovan types (had been playing pee wee soccer since they were 2). The other half were children of immigrants, mostly from Central America and the Caribbean, who grew up playing street ball or pick-up games in the park. I think this hero we're looking for is probably going to come from the children of immigrants group!

One thing I do wish is that they would do is revamp the Copa America tournament and add the USA, Canada, and Mexico to it. They have the Euros in Europe. I wish that we could have the Americas here every 4 years! People get all worked up any time the US team has to take on Mexico or any kind of powerhouse like Brazil or Argentina. I think it would go a long way to generating interest if there were a big trophy to lift and bragging rights to be had. You know there would be upsets in that and people would go ballistic if the USA managed to knock off Argentina one year to get into a final or something.

[chonies]

But it was an awesome circle, Oxynia! And it's entirely true. As far as seat-filling attention grabbers, I wish the MLS would stop going for oldsters. I don't know a lot about marketing, but it seems to me that if the MLS could get some B, C or even D list Premier/Liga stars, there are plenty of US fans who would recognize their names, bring friends who might have a vague clue, and then start building a fan base. Of course, that is why I'm a librarian and not in marketing.

So, how do Catch-22s get smashed?

[hushhush]

if the MLS could get some B, C or even D list Premier/Liga stars, there are plenty of US fans who would recognize their names, bring friends who might have a vague clue, and then start building a fan base.

Freddie Ljungberg plays for the Seattle Sounders. (Eyecandy!!) I'd put him at a B-C lister, but that hasn't really gotten much buzz.

Maybe they should place some billboards of Freddie's old CK underwear ads around the country. That would help.

I always thought Robbie Savage would be a fun player to have in the MLS! You never know what the hell he's gonna do.

I think the C-lister thing goes back to the $ issue again. Most of the C-listers are making more at West Ham or Getafe than they would at Houston Dynamo. They have to really want to come and live here for some reason. I think I read that one of Henry's reasons for wanting to come was the relative anonymity he'd experience in the US compared to Europe.

[Matilda]

Jul 12, 2010 17:33:39 GMT -4 chonies said:

But it was an awesome circle, Oxynia! And it's entirely true. As far as seat-filling attention grabbers, I wish the MLS would stop going for oldsters.

They can't really get the young players though, can they? No disrespect to the MLS but it's not a league any European player would grow up aspiring to play in. Even when they're near retirement age they'd probably still be able to make more money at a lower division club in Europe than in the MLS. Even with the lure of more money, I doubt many players in their prime would go to the MLS because there's no titles there that they'd be desperate to win and they'd also be ruining their chances of playing for their national team (Beckham's been very lucky to stay in the England squad, and I'd argue that that's only because he's David Beckham, National Pretty Boy and Head Sporting Cheerleader).

I think if the MLS wants to improve as a league and compete with the European leagues then it needs to start by increasing salaries and bringing the season dates in line with Europe (one of the biggest problems Beckham's had is that he just hasn't had a break since moving to LA - he's had to keep training through the winter to keep himself fit enough for the national team, then has to keep going through the summer for the Galaxy as well - he's said himself that his current injury is probably as a result of pushing himself too hard).

[chonies]

Jul 12, 2010 18:17:54 GMT -4 Matilda said:

Jul 12, 2010 17:33:39 GMT -4 chonies said:

But it was an awesome circle, Oxynia! And it's entirely true. As far as seat-filling attention grabbers, I wish the MLS would stop going for oldsters.

They can't really get the young players though, can they? No disrespect to the MLS but it's not a league any European player would grow up aspiring to play in. Even when they're near retirement age they'd probably still be able to make more money at a lower division club in Europe than in the MLS. Even with the lure of more money, I doubt many players in their prime would go to the MLS because there's no titles there that they'd be desperate to win and they'd also be ruining their chances of playing for their national team (Beckham's been very lucky to stay in the England squad, and I'd argue that that's only because he's David Beckham, National Pretty Boy and Head Sporting Cheerleader).

I'd agree. I also wonder if the NCAA system in the US is helping or hurting the MLS. I don't have any data to go on, but last year there was an English student at the university where I work, which is a Division II school, which means hardly any airtime and extremely limited chance of professional success in the sport who was here on a soccer scholarship. He left after the fall term because he was picked up by one of the youth leagues in England, which just had me wondering: if he was only good enough to go to a Division II school, how did he end up in what I understand to be the pre-pro feeder system?

I guess European soccer is more like American baseball, with the farm team system, but I don't know enough about that to do anything but sputter derpily on the matter.

There's a lot I don't know...need to research, I suppose. And advocate for more footballer underwear ads.

[hushhush]

I think the MLS is worried about high salaries and has taken it way too far to the other side. The NASL league of the '70s went bankrupt because they brought over Pele and a bunch of superstars.

If you have Netflix and haven't seen Once in a Lifetime: the Story of the NY Cosmos, stick it in your queue. It's a documentary worth viewing if you are a football geek.

[Matilda]

Jul 12, 2010 18:32:37 GMT -4 chonies said:

Jul 12, 2010 18:17:54 GMT -4 Matilda said:

They can't really get the young players though, can they? No disrespect to the MLS but it's not a league any European player would grow up aspiring to play in. Even when they're near retirement age they'd probably still be able to make more money at a lower division club in Europe than in the MLS. Even with the lure of more money, I doubt many players in their prime would go to the MLS because there's no titles there that they'd be desperate to win and they'd also be ruining their chances of playing for their national team (Beckham's been very lucky to stay in the England squad, and I'd argue that that's only because he's David Beckham, National Pretty Boy and Head Sporting Cheerleader).

I'd agree. I also wonder if the NCAA system in the US is helping or hurting the MLS. I don't have any data to go on, but last year there was an English student at the university where I work, which is a Division II school, which means hardly any airtime and extremely limited chance of professional success in the sport who was here on a soccer scholarship. He left after the fall term because he was picked up by one of the youth leagues in England, which just had me wondering: if he was only good enough to go to a Division II school, how did he end up in what I understand to be the pre-pro feeder system?

I guess European soccer is more like American baseball, with the farm team system, but I don't know enough about that to do anything but sputter derpily on the matter.

There's a lot I don't know...need to research, I suppose. And advocate for more footballer underwear ads.

Mmmm. [/color] And, seriously, this man [/color] needs to do one. And me.

Sorry for lowering the tone.

[hushhush]

Jul 12, 2010 18:44:43 GMT -4 Matilda said:

Sorry for lowering the tone.

OH no, Matilda. We can solve all the MLS problems and drool at the same time. Who knew Tim Howard was so heavily inked (and fit!) under all those long-sleeved GK shirts??

chonies, The one guy I have known who tried to make a go of it with soccer/football as a career was more or less told to skip college. He spent some summers training in Europe and got an offer from Ajax Amsterdam's academy but wanted to go to college first. They pretty much told him to choose one or the other because the matches he would be playing at the university level in the USA would not be competitive enough and that at age 21 or 22 he would be too old for them to work with.

[Oxynia]

the ones who play it and stick with it are usually upper-middle class white boys from the suburbs.

The Lacrosse Syndrome. Which is interesting since elsewhere, the Gods of Fútbol seem to smile on talent born from inner cities or less prosperous suburbs. That honor goes to basketball in this country.

I think you guys are right about issues with bringing over C-list European talent or kids from foreign youth leagues...not enough $$ or aspirational glory to be had here. I also don't know that it would increase MLS interest since it wouldn't fix the image of soccer as a sport for foreigners, which lots of American critics seem to argue. The MLS really needs a break-out American star who isn't from the rich white suburbs and talks like a stoned-out surfer dude [/Donovan].

Some of the European clubs have extremely robust youth programs...look at Barcelona, which became the best club in La Liga by growing its own talent vs. buying galácticos like Real Madrid did with the likes of Beckham and Ronaldo (although someone like Casillas is farm-raised and has been with RM since he was nine, and wants to coach the RM youth league when he retires). It's only possible when football is part of the cultural fabric of the country, since it needs to grow organically. Anything short of a huge injection of cash to build such a system in this country means we won't see anything like it in our lifetimes. And corporate support isn't the answer when broadcasts are limited in the amount of commercial interruption for paid advertisers.

What to do, what to do?

ETA: And because I still possess female hormones, Gourcuff does need to be in an underwear ad pronto! I predict he'll show up in one soon, as will Bocanegra.

[hushhush]

the Gods of Fútbol seem to smile on talent born from inner cities or less prosperous suburbs. That honor goes to basketball in this country.

Ironically, the best defender I had on that boys team I coached was an inner city kid who had relocated to my area from NYC. He hadn't really played much soccer at all, but I convinced him to try-out and damn if he didn't run down everything that came his way!! He basically translated that street basketball mentality to the pitch! He picked up the odd red card, but he got better as the season went on and was interested in sticking with it. His friends of course gave him no end of shit about playing a wussy girls' sport which made me angry.

At best, I think football will get a sort of cult following like the NHL has in the U.S. There are pockets of the country where NHL is a big deal, but it's still mostly viewed as a red-headed step child sport behind the big 3 of NFL, basketball, and baseball.

I still say a Copa America revamp would help. I view the interest here as being more nationalistic and intermittent like it is with the sports in the Olympic games. If you could get everybody stirred up every 2 years that would be better than what we have now.

Oxynia, are you a Real Madrid supporter?