Pride and Prejudice

[pepper67]

"Fine eyes" . . . "local beauty" . . . "one of the handsomest women of my acquaintance" . . . God I hate Hollywood.

Me too, emersende.

::joins EvilMinion in hugging her 1995 P&P DVD::

I'd like to see the earlier BBC version (with Elizabeth Garvie) though to compare it. I've heard some people say it's better than the 1995 version - which is difficult to believe.

[Deleted]

I was willing to cut the director some slack because, at first, it seemed like he was interested in creating a more "realistic" atmosphere than we usually see in period pieces. I can deal with lank hair, dirty clothes and houses, and overcast skies (it is England, after all), but I don't get where Joe Wright thinks that period accuracy has to equal UGLY. I just can't figure out his motivations. So, he changed the time period because the dresses weren't flattering enough and casts Keira Knightley - someone capable of looking extremely beautiful - and then makes her and everyone else look as plain/ugly as possible. What is the point?

It seems like the director has no interest in being faithful to the book nor does he really seem to want true historical accuracy (not that I think a movie is obligated in any way to be accurate, but a lot of the press has focused on the "realism" of this movie vs. other period pieces). It seems like he wants this movie to be set apart from other "pretty" Austen films like Emma or the 95 P&P but, as I mentioned a while ago, Persuasion did the whole "realistic" looking actors and period details and they did it excellently. If Wright tires to say that P&P is breaking any new ground where Austen is concerned... well, at least I can rest assured that he is truly a dumbass and not squandering his gifts making sure that KK isn't pouting during her scenes with Darcy.

[Deleted]

Well, I was invited to a special screening on Friday and, against all my expectations I really enjoyed the film. Here's my take on things. Sorry it's so long! I keep editing to add things...

The bad stuff first. Keira. Oh dear. Those of us there were all unanimously of the opinion that the film would have been much better without her. She wasn’t terrible, but she’s a pretty lousy actress. She does this awful, fake fixed grin at times that makes you cringe, and when she’s not doing that she’s throwing you her trademark pout. In some scenes she’s not too bad, but there was quite a lot of inappropriate sniggering coming from the audience when she was on screen – never a good thing.

The other person who was dreadful was the guy who played Bingley. I don’t know his name and I don’t want to know it. Bingley is not the brightest bulb in the box, granted, but he was not a slobbering, blithering idiot. That’s how he’s played in this film. Seriously.

Another gripe is that it is at times just was way too modern. I’m not a Jane Austen purist by any means so it didn’t bother me that much, but it still grated at times. One of the girls I was with hated every minute of the film for this reason. There’s lots of suspect scenes. The script was at times too modern, as well. I understand that it’s difficult to adapt JA for modern audiences but as Emma Thompson proved with Sense and Sensibility it’s perfectly possible.

On a more shallow note, the women were too goddamned thin and the period clothes looked awful on them! I mean we all know Keira is a rake (when she first came on the screen the woman sitting behind me gave an audible gasp and whispered to her friend, ‘My god, where are her tits?!’), but all the girls were much too thin. Most women just weren’t like that in that period and those that were were certainly not considered beauties, like Jane Bennett. The actress playing Jane had a serious case of lollipop head going on. Not attractive.

Ok, the good stuff. Firstly, it's not ugly. Not at all. In fact I thought it was stunning to look at. The scenery is just utterly, utterly breathtaking. Yes, there’s a lot of rain and mist and mud and it’s all extremely rustic, but, oh, I found it just fabulously pretty. Maybe that's just me. I'm English and I think we have some of the most beautiful scenery in the world. Especially when it's misty and raining. So others may vehemently disagree. I loved the settings.

Contrary to what some of you have said on this thread, I really liked the gritty, rustic feel of the film. The Bennett’s house is not some pretty building filled with dainty furniture. It’s shabby and dark and chaotic and noisy. There’s a lot of mud outside and there are pigs and chickens running around outside (on one very brief occasion the pig escaped indoors. There weren't farmyard animals roaming at will inside the house!). The Bennett girls, other than for the ball scenes etc, wear quite dowdy clothes. It is, in short, exactly how not-particularly-well-off country folk running an estate would have lived back then.

And the Bennetts, while not poor, were most certainly not rich. They weren't portrayed as destitute at all. They live in the middle of the rainy, English countryside, the girls spend a lot of time outside (Lizzy's love of taking long walks), thus of course they'd wear plain dresses in dark, drab colours. They weren't wearing these clothes ALL the time, just around the house and grounds. It made sense to me.

It really made the differences between the likes of the Bennetts and the Bingleys and Darcys stand out well and was very realistic. The first ball (the one where Darcy first shows up) is brilliantly done, in my opinion. Again, very rustic. The room is not an elegant one and neither are the guests. It’s sweaty, noisy, raucous and everyone is a bit drunk. It made a very refreshing change from the many other JA adaptations I’ve seen.

Now on to the all-important Mr Darcy. DISCLAIMER: I do not like Colin Firth. There, I said it. I am one of the few women on this planet that thinks his Mr Darcy is one of the most-overrated TV roles ever. Nor do I think he is handsome or magnetic or any of that rubbish. In fact, he looks almost frighteningly like my Dad’s accountant. ;D

So many of you will probably most likely completely disagree with me when I say that I thought that Matthew Macfadyen did a really good job with the part. It’s a tough role to take on considering that most people refuse to see anyone other than Firth as Darcy and he had to have a completely different approach to it. His Darcy is much more vulnerable and gauche and his arrogance is a cover for this. He’s a tortured man. By the end of the film he looks terrible – pale, dark circles under his eyes, unshaven. It's not how Darcy was written, but it was an interesting and different interpretation, and I thought he did a good job. He's seriously handsome too, which helps!

The stand-out performance for me is Tom Hollander as Mr Collins. I think he’s an awesome actor and he doesn’t disappoint here. He’s appallingly ludicrous and pompous and the scene when he proposes to Lizzie is the funniest in the film. Judi Dench is superb also as Lady Catherine De Burgh, but of course she would be. The part could have been written for her. Donald Sutherland and Brenda Blethyn (sp?) were also very good as Mr and Mrs Bennett.

[billkenobi]

thanks for that review. I am now more inclined to watch it - even if it's for glorious glimpses of the English countryside and Chatsworth.

[hal9000]

Yay! Thanks for that, Magwitch. I'm pleased to read your good review of Matthew Macfadyen.

[Deleted]

Yeah, thanks again for the review. I've always felt that Kiera is a weak actress. She seems more hype than talent these days and she's getting so many parts, it's ridiculous. I'm betting that they may trim some of those more off scenes before they release it.

I still don't know if I want to see this film or not. I may have to wait to see how people are rating it before I can decide. It costs way too much around where I live to go often. We're talking around ten bucks a pop.

[Britty]

She does this awful, fake fixed grin at times that makes you cringe, and when she’s not doing that she’s throwing you her trademark pout.

I can't stand that. She does it in every movie, and it drives me crazy.

[Karen]

Magwitch, thanks for the review! I had previously made this list of questions I want to ask people who've managed to see the film early - it may overlap a bit with parts of your review and it's long but if you have time to answer even some of the questions that would be great!

Spoilers for the book, I guess. How do they handle Elizabeth's wit? Is she shown as more mature than those around her? Her relationship with Jane? Is the behaviour of her other sisters and parents shown as embarrassing? What do the script/Knightley's acting present as the reasons for her rejection of Mr Collins? Is she tomboyish, as some reviews have claimed, a ladette with her feet on the couch? Can the viewer be expected to get the impression that she's an intelligent young woman, not just someone who can come up with decent one-liners? How modern is Elizabeth - any rebellious elements?

I read that Lydia doesn't have a big part. Is the elopement with Wickham something that gets more than a mention? Does Elizabeth do soul searching after she learns she misjudged him and Darcy?

They seem to be going against the book, having Elizabeth attracted to Darcy before she learns about Wickham/Georgiana and goes to Pemberley. Are there hints of this before the first proposal? How does she react - surprised, shocked, composed?

How is Rosamund Pike as Jane? Is the age difference between Knightley and Sutherland distracting? Does the movie go against the book by having sweet mother-daughter moments as some stills have suggested?

If you've seen some of Knightley's movies, how does her Elizabeth differ from her previous roles?

magwitch said:

The other person who was dreadful was the guy who played Bingley. I don’t know his name and I don’t want to know it. Bingley is not the brightest bulb in the box, granted, but he was not a slobbering, blithering idiot. That’s how he’s played in this film. Seriously.

Damn. I quite like Bingley. I thought he was a bit too dim even in the BBC adaptation, but is he an absolute embarrassment in the film?

Whether P&P '05 turns out to be good or bad I know there'll be no getting away from it. From now on, whenever I buy Austen literature or discuss adaptations I'll be running into mentions of this film.

[Deleted]

Lots of questions! I’ll try and answer as many as I can. Do I really need to spoiler for Pride and Prejudice? If so, please let me know and I’ll try my best to figure out how!

Elizabeth is certainly shown as more mature than the rest of her family and is portrayed as an intelligent and very independent young woman, but also there are touches of immaturity about her which goes against the book. Her relationship with Jane, for example, is irritatingly giggly. There was an awful lot of giggling going on between the two of them, in a sisters sharing secrets in their bedroom kind of way. She’s not portrayed as rebellious as such. She has nothing to rebel against, with such silly sisters, an even sillier mother and a father who detaches himself from the family in search of peace and quiet. She’s pretty much mistress of the house. The tomboy thing was irritating. The scene when she’s slouching on the couch is right at the beginning and did make me think that worse was to come, but it’s not so bad from then on. That scene was bad, though, and of course totally wrong for the period.

Rosamund Pike’s Jane was bland, but then Jane is a pretty bland character in my view. I don’t have much more to say about her performance. Pretty forgettable.

Lydia’s elopment is dealt with properly, in my opinion. It’s a devastating blow for Lizzie and she is distraught on behalf of her family. Mrs Bennett reaction is suitably hysterical, but when Lydia and Wickham show up after their hastily arranged marriage she is of course thrilled that her youngest daughter is married and forgets all about the circumstances which led to it. There’s a good scene when the family are sitting round at dinner and Lydia is babbling on and showing off her ring to Mrs B and Kitty while the rest of the family sit in stony silence and Wickham looks embarrassed and refuses to meet Lizzie’s eyes. It’s an awkward scene - in a good way - and I thought it was well handled. There follows from this the only ‘sweet’ mother/daughter moment in the film, which is subtle and not at all overdone. Mrs B. is waving Lydia and Wickham off and is crying about her ‘baby’ leaving home. Lizzie just passes her in the doorway and gives her mother a brief hug, out of pity. There were, however, some hints of tenderness between Mr and Mrs B which I thought was all wrong.

As for Lizzie’s rejection of Mr Collins…well…Tom Hollander’s Mr C was so wonderfully pompous and ludicrous that she could really do nothing else! She sits there in stunned disbelief and I think this was one of the few scenes that Keira did well. There’s a brief but touching scene between Lizzie and Charlotte when Charlotte comes to tell her of their engagement which I thought was very good. The actress who plays Charlotte is excellent, despite the smallness of the role.

Yes, there is an attraction between Darcy and Elizabeth right from the beginning! And, yes, this was one of my gripes. And a pretty major one too. I’ll leave it at that…

And as for Mr Binglely, I’m afraid I wasn’t exaggerating. If anything I was understating the horror. You remember Hugh Grant’s speech in Four Weddings when he’s blathering on about the Partridge family etc? It’s like that, but worse. All the time. It is absolutely an embarrassment. Hated, hated, hated the way they portrayed this character.

[Karrit]

I know I should probably keep my trap shut until I actually go see this movie, but I HAD to share this review by Christopher Tookey from the 6 September Evening Standard:

And I particularly loved KK. K's been a lustrous presence in movies, but her acting up to now has had only to be adequate in lightweight films...Lizzie Bennet is the trasforming role which finally proves she is more than just a pretty face.

The camera adores her mercurial ever-changing features and her swan-like neck, but it is her freshness, her unaffectedness and her emotional transparency that will endear her to audiences all over the world.

If there is any justice (which of course there isn't), KK will win Best Actress at next year's Oscars

It then goes on to admire Matthew MafcFadyen, Judy Dench, Brenda Blethyn and Donald Sutherland.

He ends the review with this:

Good though the rest of the film is, the reason P&P is more than just a big hit is down to as charming and delightful a performance by a young actress as I have ever seen. Truly a superstar is born