The Harry Potter Series

[mmmkrimpets]

the main thing jkr should be regretting about harry potter is telling her audience that you should forgive six years of abuse if the abuser in question wanted to shag your mum.

And it's an honor to name your child after that abuser as well the man you accepted as a father figure who just so happened to know you were destined to die since you were a baby and didn't think to mention it to you. Worlds Best Mom and Dad mugs all around for those kids parents who even sent their kids there. Helicopter parents bug, but lemme get this straight, a kid with a 5th grade education is going off to a school where a creature that will eat you lives in the student lounge and a batshit wizard and his minions are after the kid who sits next to you in potions class and will kill anyone who gets in their way, but hey there's quidditch! Oh and thanks to all those same moms and dads for coming back at the end to fight... oh wait.

[Mutagen]

I like that JKR introduced some complexity with Snape, but I still think his treatment of Neville blows a hole in any redemption for his character. He had to know what had happened to Neville's parents and decided to be an unrelenting dick to him anyway.

[thneed]

There were many characters for whom there's a lot of gray area, and Snape is a prime example. He's unquestionably a talented wizard, and a double agent, which is pretty badass, but he's also an asshole to Harry just because he reminds him of his parents, and he can't get over his issues to teach Harry the totally necessary skill of occlumency. The show had plenty of people on the side of good (Crouch Sr., Fudge, Scrimegeour, Percy to a lesser extent) who weren't good people. It's pretty rare to see that in a kids' book.

I remember reading Sorcerers Stone and wondering how the story would end after book 7. "If Harry ends up with Herione, then he gets the girl, but what about poor Ron? If they both end up with a girl, Harry will have to be with Ron's sister, I guess. She's the only other girl." Then I learned online that's called One Big Happy Weasly Family. And again, it makes sense for what's basically a fairy tale. The books aren't supposed to depict real relationships, they're supposed to be wish-fulfillment for kids. So Harry gets a girl and a loving family and money and a cool job.

And NappingAthena in a way they did try, as much as you can given the book's about teenagers and the romances are a light subplot, not to have them marry the first one they see. JKR made a point of giving Harry, Ron, and Hermione another partner before the happily ever after, instead of making the first relationship anyone has is Harry and Ginny, Ron and Hermione, Neville and Luna.

I think it's worth remembering that even though the books take place in the 1990s, the wizarding world is depicted as being very Medieval, mixed with the old-fashioned British Schoolboy novel. Parenting as we think of it didn't exist. It was normal to send your kids away to boarding school where the prefects would beat you up. No trying to get in a good college, because people didn't think like that. Adulthood and all its responsibilities began the second you leave school. All jobs are related to the government (the Ministry, the one official school or hospital or bank) or a few small merchants. Modern rules don't apply.

[Nysha]

I like that JKR introduced some complexity with Snape, but I still think his treatment of Neville blows a hole in any redemption for his character. He had to know what had happened to Neville's parents and decided to be an unrelenting dick to him anyway.

I agree. It's hard enough justifying his abuse of Harry based on nothing more than his hatred of James, but there's no excuse for how he treated Neville. I also give Dumbledore the side-eye for allowing that abuse to continue.

[Ninja Bunny]

Feb 11, 2014 13:05:11 GMT -4 Nysha said:

I like that JKR introduced some complexity with Snape, but I still think his treatment of Neville blows a hole in any redemption for his character. He had to know what had happened to Neville's parents and decided to be an unrelenting dick to him anyway.

I agree. It's hard enough justifying his abuse of Harry based on nothing more than his hatred of James, but there's no excuse for how he treated Neville. I also give Dumbledore the side-eye for allowing that abuse to continue.

I also agree. Whatever Snape felt for Lily doesn't change that he was an angry abuser to Harry and Neville and I can't excuse that. Snape was not a good person and I was actually horrified that Harry gave one of his kids Snape's name and lauded him as someone to emulate.

It was posted upthread but because it can't be said enough:

the main thing jkr should be regretting about harry potter is telling her audience that you should forgive six years of abuse if the abuser in question wanted to shag your mum.

By the end of book 5 I had had enough of Dumbledore and his bull and I wasn't sad that he was killed off.

[Deleted]

Ha, I wasn't that sad either to see Dumbledore go. I thought he was an ass to Harry too and made his life harder than necessary. At least the King's Cross version of him that Harry met in TDH admitted that he had been arrogant while not really knowing that much all along.

[ernestine]

I figured Harry gave his sone Snape's name because he recognized how brave Snape had been. He was a double agent. He kept the school kids safe for the year he was headmaster and he did it while knowing that everyone at the school loathed him and thought he was a traitor who had killed Dumbledore. Snape had saved Harry's life even though he didn't like him, and he spent his dying moments giving Harry all of the information that Dumbledore REALLY should have told Harry when he was alive. I think he probably came to forgive him, which left only admiration. Snape was a hardcore character that I both loved and loathed. He pretty much made the books for me. I may be in the minority, but I liked that Harry named his boy after his nemesis.

I also like that Dumbledore was so flawed. Brilliant, talented and kind, but above it all and a bit crazy. He put a LOT of faith in a bunch of kids that they could work things out on their own. He really gave them very little to go on and he had plenty of time to impart this wisdom on them.

This remains my favorite series of books and I dearly wish there were more. Sigh...

[Ninja Bunny]

I liked that Dumbledore was flawed, unfortunately at least one of his flaws was horrific. Snape may have been brave but he was still an abusive asshole.

[Deleted]

I could see not having Ron and Hermione end up together. But Harry and Hermione never had any chemistry, at least as I could see. They seemed way more like siblings.

But why not at least let Ginny give Albus one of her brother's middle names? Charlie isn't going to get married most likely, why not Albus Charles? Or Albus Neville, or Albus Colin (in honor or poor Colin Creevey). Or hey, want to honor someone's sacrifice -- why not name him Albus Regulus? No one but Kreacher knew that Regulus Black was a hero.)

(And please tell me I'm not the only one who has a crush on David Thewlis as Remus Lupin?)

[thneed]

This is the full interview: (I'm procrastinating).

Relevant bits:

What I will say is that I wrote the Hermione/Ron relationship as a form of wish fulfillment. That’s how it was conceived, really. For reasons that have very little to do with literature and far more to do with me clinging to the plot as I first imagined it, Hermione with Ron.

Watson: Ah.

Rowling: I know, I’m sorry, I can hear the rage and fury it might cause some fans, but if I’m absolutely honest, distance has given me perspective on that. It was a choice I made for very personal reasons, not for reasons of credibility. Am I breaking people’s hearts by saying this? I hope not.

Watson: I don’t know. I think there are fans out there who know that too and who wonder whether Ron would have really been able to make her happy.

Rowling: Yes exactly.

Watson: And vice versa.

Rowling: It was a young relationship. I think the attraction itself is plausible but the combative side of it… I’m not sure you could have got over that in an adult relationship, there was too much fundamental incompatibility. I can’t believe we are saying all of this – this is Potter heresy!

In some ways Hermione and Harry are a better fit, and I’ll tell you something very strange. When I wrote Hallows, I felt this quite strongly when I had Hermione and Harry together in the tent! I hadn’t told [Steven] Kloves that and when he wrote the script he felt exactly the same thing at exactly the same point.

Watson: This is just so interesting because when I was doing the scene, I said to David [Heyman]: “This isn’t in the book, she didn’t write this.” I’m not sure I am comfortable insinuating something however subtle it is!

Rowling: Yes, but David and Steve – they felt what I felt when writing it.

Watson: That is so strange.

Rowling: And actually I liked that scene in the film, because it was articulating something I hadn’t said but I had felt. I really liked it and I thought that it was right. I think you do feel the ghost of what could have been in that scene.
. . .

Watson: I think it was just the sense that in the moment they needed to be together and be kids and raise each others morale.

Rowling: That is just it, you are so right. All this says something very powerful about the character of Hermione as well. Hermione was the one that stuck with Harry all the way through that last installment, that very last part of the adventure. It wasn’t Ron, which also says something very powerful about Ron. He was injured in a way, in his self-esteem, from the start of the series. He always knew he came second to fourth best, and then he had to make friends with the hero of it all and that’s a hell of a position to be in, eternally overshadowed. So Ron had to act out in that way at some point.

But Hermione’s always there for Harry. I remember you sent me a note after you read Hallows and before you starting shooting, and said something about that, because it was Hermione’s journey as much as Harry’s at the end.

Watson: I completely agree and the fact that they were true equals and the fact that she really said goodbye to her family makes it her sacrifice too.

So, yeah. It looks like she was heavily influenced by the last movies when she made that statement about Hermione and Harry being the better couple. I didn't see the movies, but apparently Emma Watson and Daniel Radcliffe had good chemistry? Better than with Rupert Grint, anyway? Not to mention big Hollywood movies are wired so the lead boy and the lead girl end up together unless they are blood relatives. So even if it wasn't planned that way in the movies, conventional directing choices would make it hard to avoid.