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Post by Spinderella on Feb 15, 2020 2:59:06 GMT -4
TOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO MUCH BRIANNA/ROGER. Not enough Lord John, Jamie/Claire.
Watching the producers/showrunner after the episode gives me some perspective. I get that this part of The Fiery Cross had a lot focused on the wedding and the gathering -- so I guess you just have to get this shit out of the way to set up what the season has in store. But still, just not enough to give me joy.
I don't care for Roger, either. However, I understand his dickish moves to Jocasta. He gave her the response and action that she was wanting and hoped for, which pretty much says that he's not marrying Bree for money or whatever and that he's a father to wee Jemmy regardless if he's his or not. I mean, she did say at least twice that most men wouldn't want to be around a child that could be a bastard or whatever. That was pretty harsh and if someone said that to my husband about our child...he'd be LIVID.
Lord John was there at the whole ceremony with Claire acknowledging him and when Jamie came down with Bree, John was looking at them and Jamie did a nod...though it's not 100% certain if he nodded at LJ or at Gov. Redcoat.
OT/ If you've ever seen a YouTube channel called "Cinema Sins", whenever the movie/TV show says the title of the movie or something to that effect in their scenes, he'll say..."Roll Credits!" and that's pretty much me whenever it happens on Outlander.
Jamie: "...this Fiery Cross..." Roll Credits!
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Post by kostgard on Feb 15, 2020 16:57:16 GMT -4
I dislike Roger and Bree so much that I might not even watch this season. And Outlander use to be appointment TV for me. Honestly, this episode made me wonder if I should walk away too, because about 10 minutes into it I thought, “Okay, so they’ve decided to solely focus on the bombed-out Wine Mom audience.” I once tried to find interesting podcasts that talked about this show, one where the hosts enjoyed it, but still had fun and snarked on it a little. I came across one that switched between the hosts talking and listening to voicemails left by listeners. And every single one of those voicemails gushed about the romance and the passion of everything and everyone. This episode was MADE FOR those ladies. I was clearly meant to be swooning over the wedding. It was very heavy-handed with the “LOOK HOW ROMANTIC!” of it all. That might work if the couple in question were appealing at all, but...it’s Brianna and Roger. The way they insist on reciting their vows with their faces two inches apart isn’t romantic, it’s uncomfortable and weird. The flashback to Jamie and Claire’s wedding was too much and eye roll-y. I just cannot buy into this romance because Roger is such a dud (and though he usually comes around, his first impulse has been to reject Bree when she’s not the “perfect” woman - more than once, which is gross. And why Jamie kinda hates him) and Bree is just...blergh. Again, she wasn’t a brat this episode, but Sophie’s flat affect was in full effect. The poor lady just can’t do an American accent and inflect it with emotion (and she’s not a strong enough actor to make up for it in other ways). I wish she could just use her natural accent. I’ll stick it out a bit because I still like Jamie and Claire and the supporting characters who aren’t Bree and Rog, but if they stay the main focus and if the tone remains “SWOON, DAMMIT” then I will probably drop it. |
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Deleted
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Nov 28, 2024 11:58:01 GMT -4
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2020 22:02:43 GMT -4
I had this problem in the books too. When DG stopped focusing on Jamie and Claire and started following other couples, she lost my interest.
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Post by lea1977 on Feb 15, 2020 22:37:17 GMT -4
I just rematched the first season and that was magic. Wish Bree and Roger would touch those stones and Jamie and Claire return to Scotland.
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Post by Spinderella on Feb 16, 2020 22:42:27 GMT -4
I so don't want to give up on this show. I've already invested a lot of time into it and I also re-watch all the past episodes that were Jamie/Claire specific. I tolerate Bree/Roger, but they're on my last nerve. There is nothing romantic between them. There is ZERO chemistry with the two actors (and characters!) and that is just required with a show like this. I'd rather Bree and Roger be friends who find love interests in the past and rely on each other's knowledge of the future to help The Frasers and other close friends in the past.
Her accent bugs me a lot, too. I know it isn't uncommon for a child born in the United States to foreign parents to develop an United States accent, but Jesus, Sophie's accent is so shitty I would just rather her do a British accent. Hell, my problem is the shitty casting of her in the first place.
Something that grosses me out is Roger's body hair. Yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck. I hate to talk about people's bodies and that we're all different and I'm faaaaar from being a beauty queen -- but we're watching a show that is a fantasy love-fest. We're watching people acting out making love and GOD it's the horrible back hair that is just EVERYWHERE and it does not help the view to find this very sexy or really anything remotely watchable. I fast forward through all their "love" scenes. I don't think I'm alone there.
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Post by kostgard on Feb 17, 2020 3:00:27 GMT -4
I just rematched the first season and that was magic. Wish Bree and Roger would touch those stones and Jamie and Claire return to Scotland. Serious question - is there a legitimate reason why Bree and Rog can’t go back? I mean, Claire stays because Jamie can’t go through the stones. But both Rog and Bree have gone through - wouldn’t they rather live in a time with hot showers and vaccines? Where their child probably won’t die from a fever or small pox? Also, Roger still clearly hates it in the past. Just...leave. And make everyone happy. Something that grosses me out is Roger's body hair. Yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck. I hate to talk about people's bodies and that we're all different and I'm faaaaar from being a beauty queen -- but we're watching a show that is a fantasy love-fest. We're watching people acting out making love and GOD it's the horrible back hair that is just EVERYWHERE and it does not help the view to find this very sexy or really anything remotely watchable. I fast forward through all their "love" scenes. I don't think I'm alone there. Heh, at first I thought you were talking about his wig, which is terrible and horribly unflattering on him - and this is when the wigs appear slightly better this season (or at least the makeup department got better at blending the edges). Well, except for the ratty mop they put on the head of young Jamie in that flashback. Jesus, that’s the best they could do? But...yeah. I don’t mean to body-shame the actor, because honestly, he’s fine. Most humans don’t look like Jamie when naked. Us mere mortals can’t compete. And Roger isn’t supposed to look like a demi-god like Jamie. He’s a nerdy historian. But I just find Roger so repellant that his totally normal body does absolutely nothing for me, the camera doesn’t need to linger on it, and there were some close-ups in that sex scene that were really unnecessary. Like, just cut to the seniors-having-sex shot because those people don’t repel me. |
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roseland
Sloane Ranger
Posts: 2,039
Mar 7, 2005 17:11:37 GMT -4
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Post by roseland on Feb 17, 2020 8:34:37 GMT -4
I don’t know if it’s explained in the series but in the book it’s made clear that traveling through the stones is dangerous. A lot of people don’t make it through. Also, you don’t necessarily know where you’ll end up. You could end up another 200 years in the past (1576) instead of in the present day (1976). There are ways to mitigate the danger and improve the accuracy of what time you end up in but it’s not certain. And having Jem with them makes it even more problematic. What if Jem ends up in 1576 and Roger and Bree end up in 1976? Having said all that, I think Roger and Bree did make mention of going back to their regular time in the most recent episode. Roger says something to Bree about “When we go back...” when they are alone in their cottage after the wedding.
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Post by Ladybug on Feb 17, 2020 10:22:07 GMT -4
I fast forward through Roger and Brianna scenes. And I agree, Borokat, that this is a problem in the books as well. I understand if Gabaldon felt she needed to branch out and maybe she got sick of putting most of her writing effort into the two main characters, but there are other people in Outlander-world who are way more interesting than R & B. I think you can write a male romantic character who is different than Jamie, but has his own qualities that are appealing. The problem with Roger is that he is a jerk. Even in this episode, he assumes that he and Bree will go back to the future, without asking her what she wants. When she clearly is becoming attached to her father and close with her mother again. He's selfish. It's been years since I read TFC, but I'm pretty sure this season we get Ian back. And can we see Fergus and Marsali? Much more interesting couple than Bree and Roger. The sex montage  no thanks! ETA- also, I recall that in the book Gabaldon gives a lot of cultural background and context for the Scots burning a cross at the gathering, and also touched on Claire and Bree being like WTF? There was zero of that context in the show last night and it needed to be there. |
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Post by kostgard on Feb 17, 2020 13:50:22 GMT -4
ETA- also, I recall that in the book Gabaldon gives a lot of cultural background and context for the Scots burning a cross at the gathering, and also touched on Claire and Bree being like WTF? There was zero of that context in the show last night and it needed to be there. Heh - I was wondering about that. I fully expected at least Bree or Rog to be all, "You're going to burn what now?" I think between that and making sure the cross looked nothing like the crosses we're used to seeing like that, they just wanted to avoid the comparison completely. I think you can write a male romantic character who is different than Jamie, but has his own qualities that are appealing. The problem with Roger is that he is a jerk. Even in this episode, he assumes that he and Bree will go back to the future, without asking her what she wants. When she clearly is becoming attached to her father and close with her mother again. He's selfish. That's the thing - Roger is a complete dud. It's not "Well, he isn't Jamie" it's that he sucks. He seemed like a nice enough nerdy guy at first, but as soon as he and Bree got together he's been one level of awful or another. He slut-shames her for wanting to have sex with him (even though he's had sex outside of marriage), but then was cool with just doing some hand fast thing so they could get it on. He finds out Bree was raped and is pregnant, and his first impulse was not even to see her to make sure she was okay (even if he would have issues claiming the child), but to be all, "Hmmmm, maybe I don't want this?" He hasn't figured out that things work a little differently here and maybe he needs to show some respect if he wants it returned (like, again I get that Aunt Jacosta was intentionally pushing his buttons, but his reaction just felt really disrespectful in addition to being angry. And when Jamie was calling people to arms, he was looking straight at Roger, making it clear that as his brand new son-in-law, it was his duty to step up in that moment, even if immediately afterwards he whispers in Jamie's ear, "Uh, I don't know a thing about battle. Not sure I can do this." He needed to do right by Jamie publicly. Instead he just stands there, some dude beats him to it, and Jamie has to call Roger forward by name). And most of all, he doesn't like it back in the 18th century. Which...don't blame him. But, like, dude, walk away. You're not happy. In the end, it would be better for everyone and you get to have hot showers. |
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Post by angelaudie on Feb 17, 2020 13:54:12 GMT -4
I can’t shake the feeling they are setting up Murtaugh’s death. I don’t think Jamie will kill him but that last scene felt like a permanent goodbye. Plus, Murtaugh is dead in the books.
Call me old fashioned but I’m pretty sure it’s poor wedding etiquette to discuss the bride’s rapist is still alive at the wedding. I’m not biggest Brianna fan but yeesh. Let the poor woman enjoy her wedding!
Wedding sex montage was weird. Was I supposed to start laughing at Lord John looking sad at the end? I hope so because I cracked up!
Can we get a spin off where Marsali and Fergus get drunk and recite tongue twisters?
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no thanks!