Fifty Shades of Grey

[Neurochick]

Jul 28, 2014 7:40:47 GMT -4 Mutagen said:

I don't think anyone has to justify what gets them off. If that's 50 Shades, so be it.

However, the book has entered popular consciousness at this point, so on that grounds, I think it's fair to speak up and challenge some of the themes of the book.  Personally, I'm kind of resentful of the idea that 50 Shades is what all women secretly REALLY want, or that this is how BDSM works, or that anyone who has a problem with the abusive themes of the book is just a prude.  I think you can be understanding of the fact that people's fantasies can be kind of dark and messed up and that's OK, while also being critical when a particular fantasy is seen as THE epitome of kinky fun for women.

Yes, you said it better than I did. Fantasies can be pretty dark and fucked up, but so be it, we don't all like the same things. For the record, I too thought the books were badly written, the third being the worst.

But here's my thing. I resent it when I read comments about these books, written by educated people and they'll say something like, "the only people who read these books are bored housewives" or something like that. First, so what if bored housewives read it, second, it's bullshit. The women I know who have read these books get up early in the morning and have one and two hour commutes to work, they take care of their children, some are single, some married, some divorced, many of them are barely making ends meet. So that's what bugs me about much of the criticism.

[chonies]

I approximately never want to hear what gets off 99.999% of the people I know, other than something like, "I have a crush on Agent Scully" or "have you ever wondered if Mr Peanut has genitalia?"

I understand that 50 Shades of Grey is largely meant to be erotica, but now instead of wondering why people like it, I think I might pass altogether because I don't want to turn a light, literary conversation into taxicab confessions.

[chiqui]

The thing with 50 Shades is that it can be interpreted, analyzed, and critiqued as many works of fiction are, in several different ways. There's the actual writing, and how it works as a novel. Then the erotica aspect of it (how hot it gets you) which as we all know will vary from person to person, for many different reasons. Then there's the critique of the actual sexual fantasy behind it: as one particular woman's fantasy, and the general fantasy meant to appeal to most women. These two fantasy aspects are where haters and lovers alike are blowing off the most steam, because they are the most personal. Then, there's the whole cultural aspect part of it, which includes the marketing.

Now, I'm not defending the book. I still think the mechanics of it are atrocious -- poor plotting, character development, pacing, description, grammar, etc. But I can see that even through this mess, some people may find the sexual fantasy part of it appealing. I don't mean just the actual sex scenes, but the idea of it, the whole naif-takes-on-bad-boy-and-wins theme, even though it's highly unrealistic, as many sexual fantasies are. (Because they're fantasies, people!)

What I find incredible is how anyone has the time and patience to slog through the repetitive, dull prose and clunky plot of all three books to enjoy that fantasy.

[piscessiren]

As an aside to chiqui's post: How soon before there's a Cliff Notes for the Fifty Shades trilogy?

As for the trailer, best laugh I had all week! This is going to turn into a cheeze-fest like "Showgirls".

[Martini Girl]

What I want to know is: Does Dakota bring her parents to this premiere? I mean, how awkward would that be? What would the after party conversation be like? "Hey mom and dad, did you like all of my S&M scenes?" Do her half brothers come? Childhood friends? I just don't think I'd know where to look!

[GoldenFleece]

Jul 28, 2014 17:47:10 GMT -4 Martini Girl said:

What I want to know is: Does Dakota bring her parents to this premiere? I mean, how awkward would that be? What would the after party conversation be like? "Hey mom and dad, did you like all of my S&M scenes?" Do her half brothers come? Childhood friends? I just don't think I'd know where to look!

Jamie and Dakota did a couple of interviews together to promote the trailer and she said that no, she wouldn't want her parents to see that, any more than she'd want to see them doing sex scenes.

Here's the taped interview (plus some EL James) and the live one. Maybe they're less awkward together when they're acting?

[Deleted]

My objection to it was that I really disliked the heroine. Really, really, really. I tend to gravitate towards books with strong female protagonists and this chick is dumb as a box of hair. That insulted me. But I have to admit, I don't think anyone is reading these books looking for a role model.

I think the bored housewife trope is lazy writing on the part of journalists. Because I know plenty of career women who have read this series.

[chonies]

Jul 28, 2014 13:05:27 GMT -4 chiqui said:

The thing with 50 Shades is that it can be interpreted, analyzed, and critiqued as many works of fiction are, in several different ways. There's the actual writing, and how it works as a novel. Then the erotica aspect of it (how hot it gets you) which as we all know will vary from person to person, for many different reasons. Then there's the critique of the actual sexual fantasy behind it: as one particular woman's fantasy, and the general fantasy meant to appeal to most women. These two fantasy aspects are where haters and lovers alike are blowing off the most steam, because they are the most personal. Then, there's the whole cultural aspect part of it, which includes the marketing.

Now, I'm not defending the book. I still think the mechanics of it are atrocious -- poor plotting, character development, pacing, description, grammar, etc. But I can see that even through this mess, some people may find the sexual fantasy part of it appealing. I don't mean just the actual sex scenes, but the idea of it, the whole naif-takes-on-bad-boy-and-wins theme, even though it's highly unrealistic, as many sexual fantasies are. (Because they're fantasies, people!)

What I find incredible is how anyone has the time and patience to slog through the repetitive, dull prose and clunky plot of all three books to enjoy that fantasy.

I like this, because it opens the door for an honest critique. I don't think dignifying the book with a serious critique means that anyone is defending it or going to put it on a high school reading list, and obviously it resonates for some reason, even if that reason is not so much about the book but instead perhaps something like the idea of participating in mass culture to feel less alone, or the idea that it's a bit of a transgressive thrill to have erotica blatantly available in Target.

ETA: I also agree with Borokat--by way of metaphor, a feminist blogger I normally read and enjoy also writes extensively about why Law & Order: SVU is anti-feminist and bad for society and rape victims. Sure, I get it, but why I can't I just hate it because it's dull and obnoxious?

[chiqui]

obviously it resonates for some reason, even if that reason is not so much about the book but instead perhaps something like the idea of participating in mass culture

This is it exactly, plus the naughty thrill of it (mostly because it was marketed as naughty; what sex there is, in spite of its so-called kinkiness, is pretty standard)

[FotoStoreSheila]

Jul 28, 2014 16:30:36 GMT -4 piscessiren said:

As an aside to chiqui's post: How soon before there's a Cliff Notes for the Fifty Shades trilogy?

As for the trailer, best laugh I had all week! This is going to turn into a cheeze-fest like "Showgirls".

Based on the wickedly awful trailer, there's no chance it'll be a legitimate hit like 'Basic Instinct'.

50SoG can only hope for the cult of status of 'Showgirls' or '9 1/2 Weeks'. I'm thinking it'll end up like 'Exit to Eden'-- so terrible it's not even worth snarking on.