John Lennon

[Beyle]

Dec 5, 2021 6:41:43 GMT -4 gremlin45 said:

I can't stand John because he was a deadbeat dad.

Same. Julian has said that Paul McCartney was a better father to him than John.

I'm also another person who has never blamed The Beatles breakup on Yoko. They were bound to break up at some point due to the egos alone.

[horseface]

Dec 5, 2021 18:21:22 GMT -4 Beyle said:

Dec 5, 2021 6:41:43 GMT -4 gremlin45 said:

I can't stand John because he was a deadbeat dad.

Same. Julian has said that Paul McCartney was a better father to him than John.

I'm also another person who has never blamed The Beatles breakup on Yoko. They were bound to break up at some point due to the egos alone.

Julian has been quite vocal about the hurt his father caused him. Paul said something very astute in one interview. I am paraphrasing, but essentially said that both he and John lost their mothers very young. They were only in their teens. All of Beatles grew up in less than lush circumstances. I mean...Ringo had no indoor plumbing. Their children did not have to cope with poverty and such. Paul once said that all the children of the Beatles were, "softer" than their fathers. He did not seem to mean this as an insult. He just was aware that unlike their parents they grew up in different circumstances, and thus had different expectations and needs. He was quite "tuned into this." Based on Cynthia book and Julian's interviews I do not think John was as aware of this at all.

[cremetangerine82]

Dec 5, 2021 6:41:43 GMT -4 gremlin45 said:

I can't stand John because he was a deadbeat dad.

Third times postings the charm!

I can’t excuse John, but I can contextualize and understand it. In 1962, reliable contraception was difficult to come by, and when Cynthia became pregnant, John’s choices were: 1) marry her; 2) abandon her to being a single mother of an illegitimate child, difficult in the 1960s; 3) placed the baby up for adoption after birth; or 4) have an illegal abortion that could have killed Cynthia or leave her unable to have children ever again.
Frequently, John gets reductively typecast as a heartless asshole, but he did pick the best choice out of a very difficult situation. Also, being the son of an absentee father unfortunately unconsciously repeated the cycle of being an absentee father. With the maelstrom of Beatlemania consuming his life, being a very young father, addiction to alcohol and drugs, divorce from Cynthia, possible interference from Yoko, and moving across the Pond, and the birth of Sean made connection to his firstborn difficult. In one of last interviews, John said his greatest regret is not being a better father to Julian. What makes his brutal murder even more tragic is John was trying to reconnect with Julian and being a better father to Sean.

I’m glad Julian has made peace with his father and, when attending the Peter Jackson “Get Back” documentary preview screening with his half-brother Sean said “the film has made me love my father again”.

[kostgard]

It just bums me out the way things were with Julian. Especially watching the doc and seeing how cute John was with Heather when she was in the studio. Like, can’t you do that with your own kid? Julian also wasn’t credited as a producer on the doc the way Yoko and Sean were. I don’t know if he wasn’t asked or if he wasn’t interested.

But it is nice that he remains close to Sean when he could easily resent him. And I understand his relationship with Yoko is at least cordial. And glad that he’s remained friends with Paul.

[cremetangerine82]

Look on the bright side, Paul McCartney gave us a classic to console Julian after his parents’ separation, “Hey Jude”.

[Beyle]

Dec 5, 2021 20:02:40 GMT -4 kostgard said:

But it is nice that he remains close to Sean when he could easily resent him.

I'm glad you mentioned this because it's true. Julian easily could have resented Sean for getting the attention he never did from their father. As far as I know, Julian and Sean are pretty close, right? I don't think Julian ever held Sean responsible for the neglect he felt as a child.

[cremetangerine82]

Dec 6, 2021 2:03:33 GMT -4 Beyle said:

Dec 5, 2021 20:02:40 GMT -4 kostgard said:

But it is nice that he remains close to Sean when he could easily resent him.

I'm glad you mentioned this because it's true. Julian easily could have resented Sean for getting the attention he never did from their father. As far as I know, Julian and Sean are pretty close, right? I don't think Julian ever held Sean responsible for the neglect he felt as a child.

Yes, Julian and Sean are close, they attended a preview screening of “Get Back” in Los Angeles.

[Ridha]

Dec 5, 2021 19:09:05 GMT -4 horseface said:

Dec 5, 2021 18:21:22 GMT -4 Beyle said:

Same. Julian has said that Paul McCartney was a better father to him than John.

I'm also another person who has never blamed The Beatles breakup on Yoko. They were bound to break up at some point due to the egos alone.

Julian has been quite vocal about the hurt his father caused him. Paul said something very astute in one interview. I am paraphrasing, but essentially said that both he and John lost their mothers very young. They were only in their teens. All of Beatles grew up in less than lush circumstances. I mean...Ringo had no indoor plumbing. Their children did not have to cope with poverty and such. Paul once said that all the children of the Beatles were, "softer" than their fathers. He did not seem to mean this as an insult. He just was aware that unlike their parents they grew up in different circumstances, and thus had different expectations and needs. He was quite "tuned into this." Based on Cynthia book and Julian's interviews I do not think John was as aware of this at all.

In some ways though I think the death of a loving parent is emotional easier to get through, than the abandonment of a parent especially when that abandonment is selective. Had Julian had a full sibling and they’d just been abandoned by a father in a cut and dry fashion I can’t see that causing quite as many issues and complexes as a semi present father who dotes on another sibling. In that sense (although in a general sense I absolutely agree that current generations are softer than previous generations who just got on with things) I disagree with Paul that this is any indication of Julian being softer. I think clear favouritism is a just an emotionally fucked up thing to get deal with compared to what the Beatles childhoods were like.

[Deleted]

Julian is almost 60! that’s all I got at the minute oh and i will always have a soft spot for Too Late for Goodbyes

[cremetangerine82]

Dec 6, 2021 6:16:10 GMT -4 @fitz said:

Julian is almost 60! that’s all I got at the minute oh and i will always have a soft spot for Too Late for Goodbyes

Hell, Paul, McCartney turns 80 next year! Damn, I turn 40 next year!

I have watched the three parts of Get Back, and John’s witty asides and goofing off has made me smile during a difficult holiday period, so that’s been helpful. Although, the sadness that he’s been gone longer than he was here as of this week is still heartbreaking.